Re: [爆卦] 女权杂志:亚洲女性歧视亚洲男性

楼主: Adair1104 (Adair)   2018-03-21 09:12:58
女权杂志做出回应了
FB连结:https://www.facebook.com/aprilmagazine/posts/560897077624390
FB内容:
We’ve noticed that one of our articles (https://goo.gl/ZEqFp1) is being used
by some Chinese internet users to attack the Chinese feminists.
It seems that some users are distorting the article and making false
translations to pursue their own agenda. The point of our article was to be
aware of internalised racism, it has nothing to do with condemning a gender,
let alone attacking women in general.
Facing this outrageous situation, we've decided to give Chinese feminists
more platform, more voice on our magazine.
If you know any Chinese feminist who can write for us, please let us know.
重点:
中国人超坏,竟然用我们的文章攻击中国女权主义者
我们是要强调种族之间的内化,而不是挑起性别对立
心得:
赞成杂志,亚洲男性被亚洲女性74
本来就是种族问题,怎么可能挑起性别对立
※ 引述《Machinator (我的狗叫习近平)》之铭言:
: ※ [本文转录自 Gossiping 看板 #1Qhz1S3s ]
: 作者: zhxl (武装肥宅) 看板: Gossiping
: 标题: [爆卦] 女权杂志:亚洲女性歧视亚洲男性
: 时间: Mon Mar 19 22:59:37 2018
: 探讨“亚洲女性仇视亚洲男性”的议题
: 此文出于专门关注亚洲女生权利的杂志 april magazine 上
: 原文网址:https://goo.gl/9HHf73
: 原文
: I was in the eighth grade when I first encountered a self-hating Asian. The
: person in question was a 1.5th generation Korean girl and one of the few
: other Asian students in my nearly all-white Canadian high school. Being
: (heterosexual) teenaged girls, we naturally spent a lot of our time together
: discussing cute boys. I can still remember her reaction when I mentioned that
: my long-time crush was the boy who sat in front of me during my after-school
: Chinese classes.
: “Oh, so he’s an Asian guy,” she said dismissively. Seeing the confused
: look on my face, she quickly added, “It’s just that they’re always so
: nerdy, you know? And most of them are kind of ugly, too.”
: My friend wasn’t alone in holding these views. Since then, I’ve listened to
: countless Asian women sing their excuses for why they refused to date within
: their own race. Between the never-ending chorus of “It’d be like dating my
: own brother” or “I just happen to have more in common with white guys,” I
: began to understand that these excuses were simply an expression of their
: internalized racism. Rather than confront these feelings, they chose to craft
: a narrative where Asian men were too [fill in the blank with an undesirable
: characteristic of your choice], thus absolving them of personal
: responsibility for their dating decisions.
: Of course, on closer inspection, it was clear that their rationalizations
: were riddled with inconsistencies. For one thing, in order for their
: collective testimonies to be true, Asian men would have to occupy a very
: paradoxical position on the spectrum of male undesirability—vilified as
: patriarchal overlords by one woman and then mocked for being geeky losers by
: the next.
: Moreover, while these women vehemently resisted being labeled themselves,
: they couldn’t recognize their own hypocrisy in stereotyping other groups.
: Take, for example, this article written by an international student from Hong
: Kong attending university in the UK. She discusses the ethnic stereotypes she
: has encountered and ultimately reaffirms that people are just “individuals
: with variety after all.” She then ends her piece by remarking that Chinese
: men are, in fact, “smaller” than white men.
: This article ties into a larger trend of Asian women publicly vocalizing
: disdain for their Asian male counterparts. Gina Choe and Jenny An both felt
: compelled to broadcast their Asian-exclusionary dating preferences on public
: platforms. Comedian Esther Ku routinely exploits (false) stereotypes of Asian
: men during her shows. A couple months ago, she even tweeted a video thanking
: United Airlines for assaulting Dr. David Dao. I want to be clear: there’s
: nothing wrong with choosing to be in an interracial relationship. There’s
: everything wrong with having to insult the men of your own race when you do.
: Our current racial climate is inherently hostile and discourages anything
: that fosters a strong sense of self-esteem among all POC living in the West.
: Whiteness is often the unspoken prerequisite to success and respect, which
: incentivizes minorities to seek further inclusion into white society. For
: some Asian women, this involves disassociating themselves entirely from Asian
: men. These women are certainly not representative of the average Asian woman
: from any country. However, we also can’t deny that this vocal minority has
: swallowed up a disproportionate amount of room in what little space is
: granted for our voices. And there’s been minimal effort on our part to
: censure them.
: Taken in the collective, the actions of these individuals illustrate the
: broader failure of our community to facilitate open discussion on issues like
: internalized racism. As a diverse and immigrant-heavy population, the
: development of our racial consciousness remains in its fledgling state. The
: foundation of our activism, therefore, depends on our ability to solidify a
: positive Asian identity—and we can start by calling out the self-haters
: among us.
: (Written by Yuenting J. Yuenting is a third generation Chinese-Canadian
: currently attending university.)
: 粗略的意思是部分亚洲女性找了许多借口来污蔑贬低亚洲男性
: 将沙文主义、鲁蛇、甚至是种族歧视的字眼都莫须有的套在亚洲男人身上
: 将亚洲男性贬低的一无是处好让她们喜欢白人的行为合理化
作者: deathly (隐者)   2018-03-21 09:18:00
应该是要强调"各种族内部间存在的种族歧视" 不是内化
作者: RLH (我们很近也很远)   2018-03-21 09:18:00
这就是英文版的女人迷啊
作者: deathly (隐者)   2018-03-21 09:20:00
比如,同样都是黄种人 富有的歧视贫穷的 或是 同种族男性歧视女性 大概是这样其实我有个问题 文章内点出 亚洲女性歧视男性当男性歧视女性时 这些杂志会鼓励女性反抗 责怪但当情况反过来时 杂志又说不应该责怪女性 ?????????我觉得这真的很有趣呢
作者: vicious666 (Seth)   2018-03-21 09:33:00
还好吧?就国外的自助餐阿
作者: yellowones (yellowones)   2018-03-21 10:38:00
请问楼上D大的解读是从哪个段落来的?我们看的是同一篇文章吗there’s: nothing wrong with choosing to be in an interracial relationship. There’s: everything wrong with having to insult the men of your own race when you do.Taken in the collective, the actions of these individuals illustrate the: broader failure of our community to facilitate open discussion on issues like: internalized racism.都帮忙整理好了就不要再乱解读了
作者: deathly (隐者)   2018-03-21 12:06:00
我翻的是FB的内容THE POINT OF OUR ARTICLE 开始 原PO写内化但实际上应该不是内化 我不是翻文章的 我是在翻FB贴文另外 解读也很正常接下来 IT'S HAS NOTHING TO DO WITH ....是在说 我们无意责怪任何一个性别, LET ALONE更别说责怪女性 所以我的解读哪里有问题当男性歧视女性 这些杂志就会责怪 或是鼓励反抗今天反过来了 就只是轻描淡写的说一句 我们没想责怪谁HOLY **** YOU GUYS GUST LIKE "TWO-FACED" HAHAIT HAS NOTHING TO DO 是指与此无关 阿不就是在说我们无意责怪任何性别今天转FB 我就翻FB 我是不知道Y大去哪找来的啦打错了 You guys just like "TWO-FACED" HAHAHA~~到底是谁解读有问题啊?
作者: yellowones (yellowones)   2018-03-21 13:12:00
欸,楼上的,人家一开始就说了文章的意义是讨论internalised racism,没有在讨论性别歧视耶,我可以理解这个议题跟性别议题一定有关,可是人家都说本意非如此了你这样解读你真的觉得没问题吗
作者: deathly (隐者)   2018-03-21 13:15:00
内部的种族歧视 然后又扯到男女性 然后说没讨论性别歧视??? 举个例子吧 政府说我们讨论的是薪资问题然后讲到企业跟劳工之间状况 薪资等 然后再回头说这只是
作者: yellowones (yellowones)   2018-03-21 13:16:00
他是说我们无意谴责任何性别,更不用说会拿这样的文章来攻击女性(可能有些反女权的用了那篇文章去无差别责备女性吧),你好像根本没看懂吧
作者: deathly (隐者)   2018-03-21 13:16:00
讨论薪资问题 无关于劳工与雇主之间关系的讨论 ??????
楼主: Adair1104 (Adair)   2018-03-21 13:17:00
无意谴责任何性别,结果说"女"歧视"男" QQ好复杂喔
作者: yellowones (yellowones)   2018-03-21 13:18:00
他就说了文章的主旨是想讨论种族歧视了,你要讨论性别
作者: deathly (隐者)   2018-03-21 13:18:00
对啊 无意谴责 这是女对男的状况 换到男对女试试看
作者: yellowones (yellowones)   2018-03-21 13:19:00
不是啦,无意谴责任何性别主要的对象应该是那些有内部歧视的女性,并不是男性哦就像你觉得性别议题跟这个文章想讨论的内容脱不了关系,可是人家想要把重点放在部分亚洲女性对亚洲男性的内部歧视上,我觉得你想讨论性别议题也是可以再开一篇文啦
作者: deathly (隐者)   2018-03-21 13:20:00
对啊 他们不谴责女性啊 因为女性对男性有歧视 但不谴责今天我问你啊 如果状况反过来呢?今天如果是男性歧视女性 他们会说我们不谴责男性吗?我想凸显的就是你们这些双面人 话都给你们说我哪里解读有误 我在上面翻译就写了 无疑谴责任何性别何况攻击女性 废话,今天是发现女性歧视男性 才这样说你对换看看 变成男性歧视女性 这个杂志会说这么好听难道会说 我们无意谴责任何性别 更何况攻击男性?
作者: yellowones (yellowones)   2018-03-21 13:24:00
哦那这样我懂了,我同意啊我也觉得应该谴责这些会内部歧视的女性,只是并不是谴责一个特定性别,而是会内部歧视的这个女性群体吧,对吗
作者: deathly (隐者)   2018-03-21 13:25:00
你举义举例哪一个女权杂志会这么说 我洗眼恭看
作者: yellowones (yellowones)   2018-03-21 13:26:00
我不会想为没有看到的文章或事件默认立场,所以我不觉得去假设情况反过来会怎样,如果是我那标准当然要统一囉,只是其他人怎么想我怎么控制啊XD
作者: deathly (隐者)   2018-03-21 13:26:00
简单来说 你认为应该谴责的就是部分人这样也没错 毕竟不能因为部分人 就谴责全部人
作者: yellowones (yellowones)   2018-03-21 13:27:00
我没有在看女权杂志耶,我自认为是女权主义者可是不代表所有自称女权主义者的言论都应该同意吧
作者: deathly (隐者)   2018-03-21 13:28:00
但这篇杂志还是有偏颇的地方 今天如果状况反过来
作者: jimabc (Je t'aime)   2018-03-21 13:28:00
英文版女人迷+1 仇男大本营
作者: deathly (隐者)   2018-03-21 13:29:00
我质疑他是否会写上我们不责怪任何性别 更遑论攻击
作者: yellowones (yellowones)   2018-03-21 13:29:00
对啊我就是这个意思,文章也是写了不要谴责特定性别,倒是要不要谴责特定群体他就没说了,所以我是不会去假设他们会不会谴责啦看起来我们有共识了是吗XD
作者: deathly (隐者)   2018-03-21 13:30:00
如果这个杂志对于男性歧视女性的态度 与女性歧视男性的态度是一致的 那我没话说问题就是现在很多不是如此单纯就"谴责有问题的群体" 而非"谴责全体" 我同意
作者: tsming (断水流大师兄)   2018-03-21 14:49:00
自助餐式回应,反正女森就是不能骂XDDD
作者: ccnoire (热爱生活 >///<)   2018-03-21 20:52:00
英文待加强

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